Subject: Re: dir command

From: Tim Capps <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 1996 12:50:53 -0800

>I don't agree on this one. The next thing that will not run is tar, compress,
>gzip and other convertors.

True.  However, how many messages on this list do you see about that?
Answer: Very few.  I'd guess that a lot of folks never use the tar,
compress, gzip converters.  Folks who do need to solve the problem,
but why make everyone do it?

>Complete answers for both are in the FAQ at
>http://www.hvu.nl/~koos/wu-ftpd-faq.html

Not so.  I worked for a couple of weeks to get SunOS 4.1.4 running.
I have no interest in the tar/gzip/whatever converters, and so I
won't be spending any time at all on that.  I could have better used
the time I wasted figuring this out on something else.  I suspect
that a large number of folks will be in the same situation (correct
me if I'm wrong people, and I'll shut up).

It seems to me that basic functionality should happen right out of 
the box.  If you want to get exotic, then fine, maybe it takes a little
more work.  One might wonder why "ls" is part of the basic package?
Why not have that call the external "ls" command?  I suspect because
it is problematic to get that stuff working in the first place.

>In general : this list is not about the newest 'simpleterm for windows', it's
>about a special kind of ftp-server. Which means (in my opinion) that people
>should read the manual first, read the faq too, read all the readme's that
>come with wu-ftpd, and *then* ask questions.

Right.  I did that.  It was no help.  I then spent a lot of time on this
and finally got it to work.  I don't like to waste my time like this.

Cheers,
Tim

---

From: Michael Brennen <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 1996 17:50:04 -0600 (CST)

> it is problematic to get that stuff working in the first place.

Basic functionality does happen right out of the box; the 'ls' command
with no options is built in.  And yes, it is problematic to get the other
stuff working. 

This is not point and click on "setup.exe".  Given the variety of Unix
flavors that this thing runs on and the variety of things that don't work
(SETPROCTITLE, etc.) from OS to OS, it is to be expected that it takes
more than 'make; su; make install' to get it running.  The library
directory and permissions structure required for installation of dynamic
libraries varies so much from OS to OS that it would be yet another big
effort to get it to that point. 

Hacks contributed by the mail list inhabitants have greatly simplified the
installation process; it is not perfect yet, and documentation can be
improved.  If you find something that can be improved, submit a patch to
the list and it will be incorporated into the beta release.  wu-ftpd got
where it is today by people doing just that. 

RE the FAQ: Washington University controls the listserver, and they have
not seen fit to update the subscription docs to reflect the location of
any of the ongoing work.  Evidence over the past year seems to indicate
that they want to dissociate from it as much as they can.  At least now we
have a name that is associated with the university; for a long time we
didn't have that. 

I for one appreciate their willingness to at least keep the list alive,
but the product needs the hacks that have been done to it, and people need
to know about them.  There are major problems in the "official" release. 

Andrew, could you at least update the new subscriber info to point to the
new FAQ?  That will be enough to point people to the beta release as well
as other resources that can help people securely and more efficiently set
up this loveable beast.  Put on all the disclaimers you want about not
being responsible, it's an "unofficial" FAQ, etc. 

On another point: this is a potentially serious hole on your server if you
don't get it right.  Part of pulling wu-ftpd up is studying and
understanding the details of directory permissions, guest and real access,
etc.  The resources in the FAQ can help that process.  Take this thing
*seriously*, because if you don't you've left one of your front doors
open.  A quick and dirty installation will get you hacked quick and dirty. 

Michael
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